Saddle x 4T2 x Evmos AMA
28 min read

Saddle x 4T2 x Evmos AMA

Saddle x 4T2 x Evmos AMA
Saddle x 4T2 x Evmos AMA

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  0:01
Alrighty. Hello, it is 1:35 EST. And with that it is time to begin. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another lovely day on the ranch. I'm Low Poly Duck, that is the only duck who speaks English. Don't trust cartoons, those aren't even real ducks. I'm joined by Christian partnership lead at Saddle finance. Christian, welcome.

Christian | Saddle  0:22

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  0:23
And today we're going to be chatting with 4T2. A very exciting project, whose function is actually inspired by the very popular Convex, maybe you've heard of them and whose marketing takes inspiration from a series that I actually hold very dear to my heart. I'm absolutely over the moon, no pun intended, to be hosting some Douglas Adams fans here today. 4T2, happy to have you.

Dan | 4T2  0:47
Thanks. Thanks so much for having us here today.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  0:51
Excellent. So today we're going to be chatting about your platform, our partnership, and maybe we can clear up some of this EVMOS stuff for my tiny little ETH Maxi duck brain. Christian, do you mind if I let our guests start with some introductions?

0xAces | 4T2  1:07
Yeah, sure. Absolutely.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  1:08
Excellent. So can you guys tell us a little bit about yourselves? Our speakers here, starting with 4T2.

Dan | 4T2  1:18
Yeah, sure. So yeah, I think you did a good intro. So 4T2 is we're taking the concept of Convex to a large degree and and splitting that up. However, we're doing that for multiple DEXes, as well as Convex pretty much for any of this Curve for the moment, we're doing that for multiple of the Evmos DEXes. And starting at with the liquidity aggregator. The team is consists of a really really great team. So it's myself, I've just graduated from a US business school.

And I also spent some time working at Binance labs. And we've got on the rest of the team, just some really top engineers, we've got Asus on the call here as a speaker too, who was one of the founders of Yeti finance protocol and Avalanche. And then just we've got Crypto Bonaparte who's just DeFi Maxi, understands everything about the landscape. We've got another engineer who's founded layer one before and then just some really solid engineering guys who are holding up the platform. I hope that's okay for our intro.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  2:27
Oh, for sure. Goodness gracious me. Sounds like I'm not going to be able to do a whole lot of talking today. You guys are definitely gonna  outclass me here.  I'm but a lonely duck and then ETH Maxi at Evmos. Spend not much time on anywhere else, although. I have been here for a long time. You guys are definitely here one step and above. Evmos we have here as well.

Liam | EVMOS  2:52
What's up everybody? This is Liam from the Evmos team, it's great to meet you all. I handle business development, to help build out the Evmos ecosystem. For a little bit of context on what is Evmos. Evmos in its simplest form is bringing EVM or Ethereum compatibility to the cosmos ecosystem. We are our own Cosmos chain, so we are not a side chain or a layer two. But really, what Evmos is focused on is how do we expand the functionality of the EVM. And what I mean by that is taking advantage of the native interoperability that Cosmos offers.

So for instance, you know, we're talking about like, how do we enable like cross chain contract cost, and be able to move stores of value from other Cosmos chains and other ecosystems, and be able to use them within the Evmos ecosystem. So an example for instance, could be, you know, playing well with 4T2. You know, being able to aggregate yield from multiple chains, and so making it possible so that the 4T2 team can deploy their contracts using Solidity on Evmos, but then still interact with contracts and applications on other Cosmos chains such as Osmosis, or within the Juno ecosystem.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  4:11
Amazing. Love to hear that, I love to hear the expansion of interoperability. So what first drew me to ETH in the first place and is definitely what drew me to Solidity right, I definitely fell in love with EVM for that, and therefore I'm super excited to see the future of this. Also, we have with us 0xAces. Sir, my friend. How are you doing? And what do you do?

0xAces | 4T2  4:34
Hey, guys. Yeah, so. Yeah, I handle the smart contract and just the tech side of 4T2. I'm excited to be on the call. Thanks for having us.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  4:46
Excellent. Yes, we're excited to have you as well. And Christian finally, would you like to give us a little bit of an intro?

Christian | Saddle  4:53
Yeah, sure. So like you said, I'm with partnership via Saddle. I work on putting deals together between various protocols and partners across the DeFi landscape, part of that includes deploying a new blockchain, so one of the blockchains, I really want to prioritize was Evmos, just because, you know, I'm bullish, if you remember from the EVM, the Ethereum virtual machine, I think the developer community working on Solidity contracts on EVM compatible apps is, you know, far none is by far the strongest developer community in all of crypto. And then I think interoperability is just an inevitability, right? So the way I see the landscape playing out is Ethereum, is kind of monolithic blockchain, you're gonna have these L2 and starting solutions in the future that will help scale it, but all these other blockchains, right, they have really innovative technology, and they can't just be left by the wayside.

Assuming Ethereum does impact scale. So the way I see that the landscape playing out is these sovereign independent block chains are gonna have to sort of band together to be able to hold their own against the sheer volume of developer activity/liquidity on all the other on Ethereum. And all of its constituent layer twos. So the solution I think that makes the most sense in that regard is the Cosmos solution. Because you can take already existing blockchains, plug them in, and then have them all talk to each other. This can be contrasted with, say, the Polka Dot style where you have to build with the intention of bidding on a pair of chain auction, securing your spot using their settlement and consensus mechanism, etc. Or the Avalanche mechanism, which is pretty similar to Polka Dots. So I like Cosmos, I like Ethereum.

Evmos just makes sense, I think the team is solid, I think they do some good work. They've been very transparent, high with their communication with the community, keeping everybody in the loop. And they're always very responsive when working together different partnerships and passing information back and forth between Saddle, and the Evmos team. So wanted to prioritize Evmos and part of moving on to new blockchain is, of course, tying together Saddle which is a stable swap provider with all the DeFi primitives that exist, inevitably so on every blockchain, including Evmos.

So one of those DeFi primitives is, of course, the convex like forks or implementations of something that similar to convex, whereby our vote escrow token, so like the SDL token that you can lock up and vote for Saddle emissions for farm the following week get accumulated in this Convex like protocol, and so hopped on a call with the 4T2. Team. We were going very well, that seems very solid. So very anxious to to explore this partnership going forward.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  7:52
Amazing, I'd love to hear that. And actually, speaking of maybe we can hear a bit of a definition of this DeFi primitive, the Convex mechanism you explained. From the mouth of the horse as it were 4T2, would you like to give us a little bit of a breakdown of this mechanism as high or low level as you'd like? If you can,

Dan | 4T2  8:15
Yeah, sure. Thanks. And by the way, I didn't say thank you for appreciating the Douglas Adams. Douglas Adams Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy marketing that we've gone after. But yeah, so just going through exactly our mechanism essentially, we're looking at Saddle was after and rolling out our convex type mechanism or what we've called our  ve token aggregator in multiple stages. So our first phase is actually just going to be a pretty standard yield aggregator. So this is, I mean, as we've seen on some of the other yield aggregators on other chains, and that is pretty much what we're putting in whereby these protocols, all the DEXes can aggregate their yields on 4T2 protocol. And we will actually enhance their yields on those on our protocol through auto-compounding or through our native 4T2 token. And the reason we started off with yield aggregation is that we've seen it this can be a standalone protocol in itself. And what we're looking at as our phase two, the ve token aggregation, is it's kind of like I would say, it's somewhat of a moonshot products, because we here are looking at aggregating a variety of  ve tokens into our protocol. Now these have to all be whitelisted by us. So for example, Saddle is one of our partners will be our one of our primary ve token whitelist partners, whereby users will actually be able to begin staking their SDL tokens into the 4T2 platform.

Now, the way this mechanism works is we are also developing some thing which has yet to be announced, but to start incentivizing users to actually stake these SDL tokens to us ahead of any ve locks. And we're always happy to work with our partners in coming up with new ways of rewarding users to actually start staking these native governance tokens to us ahead of time. So the way that this works, just I mean, I wish I could screen share with you here, because I've got a very beautiful infographic, which actually is in our docs, which will be really soon. But LP tokens from for example, Saddle will be able to be staked into 4T2, just like on any yield aggregator, at which point we will then go stake these LP tokens into the Saddle protocol itself. At this point is usually where the user would start receiving under the Convex model will start receiving these unboosted rewards as it's called.

However, if it stakes into us, Saddle users will be able to actually receive boosted rewards. The reason that we'll be able to receive these boosted rewards is because we will be accumulating boost on the back-end. So LPs, without having to actually own their own Saddle tokens will be able to stake their Saddle tokens, their LP tokens into us and receive boosted rewards plus our own 4T2 token on top of that. And so that is the mechanism that 4T2 is going for, we are we will be offering this for a variety of different DEXes. So this works to the point whereby once we've whitelisted, a certain number of DEXes, if a user owns our 4T2 token and owns LP tokens in saddle for example, that user will have, for example, gauge votes or boosted rewards in the Saddle protocol. I hope that makes sense. To some degree.

Christian | Saddle  11:56
Yeah, Could you spend a little bit on how the boosted rewards work? So how does a user who wants to liquidity provide with Saddle for instance, get those boosted rewards and where those booster rewards come from?

Unknown Speaker  12:08
Right, so I can take that. So yeah, so that's when Saddle comes out with the ve lock mechanism that, for example, Curve, about holding veCurve, LP providers would get boosted rewards on their LP. So that's the same mechanism assuming on the DEXes we work with half dev, while come up with a V, we cannot say eventually. So that way the boost comes from.

Dan | 4T2  12:40
Yes, so where  the boost actually comes from is we as 4T2 protocol will be locking away Saddle tokens into Saddles, ve lock pools, and actually accumulating boosts. So the big thing that 4T2 does is actually disaggregates LP holders from governance holders, whereby  a governance holder of Saddle could stake their governance token to us, and will be rewarded in 4T2 platform fees. So that's their incentive of doing that, of staking their Saddle token to us. And through staking their Saddle token to us, 4T2 as a protocol actually accumulate boost by ve locking away the Saddle tokens.

Then if an LP comes and stake their LP token to us, that specific LP does not need to own any Saddle tokens to start actually accumulating or getting allocated some of this boost. And then that boost that this LP gets. a percentage of that is taken as 4T2 platform fees, and that is rewarded to the governance holder of the Saddle governance holder. So it almost creates this flywheel effect, whereby the more 4T2 e-. Sorry, the more Saddle governance holders that stake to us, the more boost and Saddle 4T2 acquires, which attracts more LPs and in Saddle, which thereby result in more platform fees attracting more Saddle governance stakers. So it creates this flywheel effect that this aggregates LPS from governance holders of Saddle.

Christian | Saddle  14:11
And will 4T2 have wrapped versions of the Saddle, so for instance, Convex has CVX CRV, which is a Convex wrapped version of CRV, are you guys planning on doing something similar?

Dan | 4T2  14:25
Yes, exactly. So once users stake their SDL token to us, users will receive a liquid and 4T2 Saddle token at a one to one rate.

Christian | Saddle  14:37
And the primary purpose for this wrapping is to enable liq- is to allow users to still be liquid.

Dan | 4T2  14:46
Exactly. And once that 4T2 Saddle token is staked into our platform, that's when user starts receiving the platform fees as well as 4T2 tokens on top of that

Christian | Saddle  15:01
So then a good question to follow up with is what exactly will the governance token? What's the utility behind the governance token above 4T2?

Dan | 4T2  15:09
Yeah, exactly. That's a good question. So there's essentially, firstly, obviously, its governance. Secondly, if a user holds a 4T2 token, as well as has staked the 4T2 Saddle token, then that user will be able to vote  in the gauge votes of Saddle, for example. And now that happens across multiple DEXes. So if a user only holds a 4T2 token, but doesn't hold the 4T2 Saddle token, then that user will not be able to vote in the Saddle's DEX, in the Saddles gauge votes. And so that's the first primary use case. The second mechanism, which we see of holding a 4T2 token, is that the 4T2 token price would be a cumulative or theoretically should be a cumulative price of all of the underlying DEXes, which are staked their tokens to us.

So just the way that we've seen the Convex token, track the Curve token in terms of price, we expect the the 4T2 token to track the saddle token, but also to track any other DEXes that we whitelist on to our protocol, because the way that we look at this is essentially if a holding company has two subsidiaries, that holding companies share price is getting revenue from two companies. So we almost see our token value being derived from the Saddle token plus any other DEXes, which are whitelisted as ve lock tokens onto our platform.

Christian | Saddle  16:42
Yeah, that's great. That makes a lot of sense. And then Could you outline a little bit? Where does the protocol revenue come from? How does that break down? Exactly?

Dan | 4T2  16:50
Yes. So that will be essentially, it's a 10% platform fee will be given to the 4T2. If you stake a 4T2 Saddle token into the platform, 10% of the fee goes to those holders. And then once you lock a 4T2 token into the platform, there's an additional platform fee of about 6%, which will be allocated to 4T2 stakers themselves. And that platform fee is taken from the boosted rewards given to LPs. So an LP is getting a much higher return than they would otherwise we're taking a percentage of that as a 4T2 platform fee, which is all reallocated to our governance holders.

Christian | Saddle  17:37
Right. Yeah. It's basically profit sharing distributed amongst all of the participants for the token holders. Which keeps them keeps us tracks the spirit of DeFi, which is good to see. Now, as far as timeline is concerned, how do you guys anticipate the your roadmap work rolling out? The launch? The phase one, phase two. Do you have a rough timeline that you can share with us?

Dan | 4T2  18:00
Yeah, sure. So we are currently we have smart contracts deployed on the testnet, currently. We're at the moment, we're just really trying to refine our frontend to be perfect. We want the user experience, we that's one strong, like core belief of our team is we want this to be as simple for users as possible. And we want users to enjoy the experience. So we're really just trying to refine our front end right now while the markets in a bit of turmoil, and hopefully deploy our phase one which yield aggregator within I guess the next few weeks, just waiting for I guess the right time in the market to launch.

And thereafter, phase two of the ve token aggregation should be rolled out, hopefully within the next two to three weeks thereafter. Going forward on our roadmap, obviously, as Liam from Evmos mention, we would like this to be interoperable between a variety of different chains. So that's where our one of our technical engineers was actually built out of layer one before we see him coming into play of like, really just seeing how we can utilize the rest of the IBC to start whitelisting protocols from  different Cosmos. blockchains Yeah,

Christian | Saddle  19:19
Great, very exciting stuff. I want to pose back to Liam at the EVMOS team. Liam, as someone who is primarily concerned, especially as someone working business development with the success of the blockchain of the Evmos blockchain. How important is the success of stable swap providers like Saddle or vote escrow accumulators like 4T2 for the overall success and health of the blockchain Evmos?

Liam | EVMOS  19:46
it's super super important Christian. I mean, you know one, you know issue that just kind of keeps coming up in crypto in general is liquidity fragmentation, for instance. And you know, when we look at ecosystems like Avalanche, last time I checked, like they're like, even though like Circle has natively issued USDC on Avalanche, that version of USDC isn't even like the main one in use, because there's so many other versions of USDC that people use. And so you know, in the Cosmos ecosystem, liquidity fragmentation is going to be come even bigger of a nightmare, because of the fact that you've got all of these different chains that are all producing different assets, they all have their own different bridges, right. And so they're bringing over different representations of USDC, and otherwise to Cosmos, and all of those assets are interoperable.

And we have a module in Evmos called the ERC 20 module that makes it possible to convert a cosmos SDK token to an ERC 20 token, and vice versa. And so it allows you to bring in all of these various assets to Evmos. Now, the big problem is all right, we've got 20 Different kinds of USDC. How do we make sure that people are really easily able to switch between various versions of USDC? Or how do we make sure that applications, you know, are able to automatically switch versions of USDC based on which kinds of user deposits.

So this is really where stable swaps, you know, come in and provide a lot of value to the ecosystem, as well as just providing value in other ways, such as stable yields, for people to park their USDC. Evmos works very closely with Nomad as kind of the primary bridge to reduce liquidity fragmentation to a certain extent on Evmos. But having stable swaps, such as Evmos or such as Saddle is certainly going to further help in the long term, just to make it improve the user experience.

Christian | Saddle  21:53
Yeah, well said. That's another thing that we're also very cognizant of is we also work very closely with Nomad as our bridging provider. And in order to avoid liquidity fragmentation we want we're focusing primarily on supporting stable coins that are bridged from Nomad. So for instance Frax is the canonical version of Frax of the token address that at the Frax team will use as like this is our version of Frax on the Evmos blockchain is actually the bridge version through the Nomad bridge.

And so by Saddle supporting primarily Nomad bridge assets, we are essentially we're trying to throw our weight behind the support of saying hey as far as tokens, token representations of USDC, USDT, Frax, DAI, you know, like the big four guys, as far as they're concerned, we want to buy virtue of only supporting the ones the versions from Nomad, we want to say, hey, these are the canonical stable coins on Evmos, we want to really avoid having multiple different versions of the same coin. And then having the markets essentially be less efficient, because then a lot of resources have to go towards making sure that the markets balanced out in the end, between arbitrage. Essentially, the markets end up being less efficient, the user experience is diminished, because a lot of people don't actually know that there's a difference between USDC bridge from Nomad versus some of his competitors, a lot of people don't actually know that and so they're stuck in a DEX trying to make a swap and they have a coin that they thought could work, it says USDC in their Metamask, but little do they know it's actually you know this competitors bridge version of USDC. So to avoid that horrible user experience, that happens a lot on say Avalanche, depending on the token you're using, we're also throwing our weight, just like the Evmos team is behind supporting Nomad as the canonical version of each of these stable coins.

Which actually brings me to my next point, which is sometime today or tomorrow, Saddle will be deploying a four pool not with UST, of course, but four pool with USDC, USDT, Frax and DAI. And the idea here is that this will serve as the backbone of DeFi on the Evmos and Cosmos DeFi ecosystem. And the idea here is we're going to balance this out 50%, stable- centralized, excuse me, 50% decentralized, all in one spot. Nomad bridge versions of the tokens native, you know, supported by the relevant players, such as Frax and then we plug into all the relevant players such as, say Diffusion, which is a DEX or 4T2 which is a vote escrow aggregator, and just try and bootstrap a lot as much of the liquidity as possible on this blockchain because we want to make sure that it succeeds, we want to make sure that we're all raising each other up and that the user experience which is the most important thing is as seamless as possible.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  25:01
Wow guys, this all sounds very very friendly. But I think as we know from peace comes war, is this would you say based on what I'm hearing anyway, could we consider this perhaps the beginning of the SDL wars? Maybe the multi chain SDL wars? What do we think?

Dan | 4T2  25:24
Well I mean the way that I think about it is and I guess the way that the industry is thought about it is although it's what it's called the wars, which sounds unfriendly, I mean, I know what Curve and Convex they've kind of played to some degree, a symbiotic relationship. But to a large degree, there obviously, are some downsides. And the way that 4T2 looks at this is we want to work with our partners. So we want to actually, we're looking at ways of incorporating into our governance type of structure and ways to build out the partnerships. So for example, one of our advisors actually mentioned potentially, with some protocols that don't want these liquid tokens on the market these, for example, 4T2 SDL tokens on the market, we could look at potentially not incorporating a liquid version of that token. So we actually look at we want to run out a symbiotic relationship with all our partners, and as Christian said, just develop a thriving friendly ecosystem, yeah. I think where the wars do come into play will potentially be in who can acquire the most SDL tokens?

And I mean, that's the same with Curve and Convex and that was the battleground. It was, I guess Convex versus Yearn versus a few other players. However, do we see any wars breaking out on that level? I don't personally think so. I mean, hopefully, we like to say internally we're ahead of the Curve. Excuse the pun on that. But yeah, we would like to actually start speaking with the Saddle team soon, to decide refining this early ve token mechanism. It hasn't really been mentioned in any of our marketing materials, yet. We're kind of keeping a lot of the mechanism behind that under wraps for now. But hopefully, that's a way to just roll to roll out our product without causing too many wars on the battleground, so to speak.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  27:28
Excellent,. Though sometimes war can be good, right? For progressing technology. Speaking of progressing, Christian, in what way do you see this relationship evolving into the future? Right, do you see us at Saddle here gaining an even deeper presence on Evmos? Do you see us supporting it through and through?

Christian | Saddle  27:50
Yeah, absolutely. So one of the partnerships one of the-. I basically want to steer the ship of that is Saddle more than direction towards working with the teams like 4T2, but on different blockchains, for instance-

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  28:03
The submarine?

Christian | Saddle  28:07
And but part of the motivation behind that desire is, you know, these these SDL wars, we think they could kick off on some of these block chains, and so it's within our best interest to make sure process many basis as possible. But also, because the user experience is just much more is significantly simplified when you have a team like 4T2 working diligently to make sure that their front end is as slick as possible, make sure the user experiences as slick as possible.

So you don't have to vote every week on gauge votes, you don't have to spend money on gas, you don't have to do all these things to optimize for the yield that you're truly after. So these partnerships make a lot of sense, but also going forward and kind of getting more deeply entrenched in the Evmos ecosystem is we've had several yield farmers reach out to us, and we think it could be in everyone's best interest to have these yields farmers work with not just Saddle but also the 4T2 team.

Because then you can have not only the seamless yield farming activity going on by having these vote escrow accumulator guys auto voting on the gauges and cutting emissions and boosting the yields. But then also having all the other yield farmers kind of integrate so that the whole market ecosystem on the Evmos blockchain as a whole becomes more efficient, because the more efficient the markets are, the better the allocation of capital is and the better everyone ends up walking away except for some arbitrages but there's always a space for them anyways.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  29:46
There's always extra room for a whale to come in Arba pool. That's absolutely true. So 4T2, maybe we could turn back to you for a moment. You say you're working quite proactively on the front end and the user experience? When can we expect a sort of teaser of that?

Dan | 4T2  30:07
I'll pass that over to 0xAces.

0xAces | 4T2  30:10
Yeah, so I guess to be safe. I want to say two weeks. Yeah, but could be sooner as well. We just redesigning the page and doing a lot internal testings.

Dan | 4T2  30:31
Yeah, we had a front end, ready for deployment. But we actually just had taken it all back to the drawing board to be honest. Like,  we could do this better and we think we've got a bit of time on outside though. Yeah.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  30:46
Yeah, that's usually the best option, right? And honestly, that shows the resilience of a team, knowing when there's more that could be done, and just honestly, taking the time to do it. I definitely respect that.

Dan | 4T2  30:59
Yeah, we try to balance that we try to balance. I mean, obviously, the industry is super fast paced that we, I mean, some of our like mentors and advisors are kind of older folk are like just one step at a time it's the long game here. You know like I think we often all get ahead of ourselves in terms of thinking that this has to be done right now. And it does, speed is definitely very important, but it's like we try to find the balance between speed and good product, I guess.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  31:31
Yeah, I mean the Ethos for a long time has been moved fast and break things around our industry but as we've seen that doesn't turn out so well, there's been some pretty crazy things happening in the news recently that may very well be the result of move fast and break things.

So Evmos, if we could toss it back to you. I was wondering if perhaps you could. I know, you gave me a little bit at the beginning and throughout a couple of your answers. If you could just double down on why I as an Eth Maxi should care about this, right? Why should I get involved? Why should I put my hard earned capital on Evmos and get involved with this whole thing here?

Liam | EVMOS  32:16
Yeah, I mean definitely a handful of reasons. You know, for one the Cosmos ecosystem is growing at a really really fast rate. You know, it's easy to look at the unfortunate events surrounding the Terra ecosystem last week, and say that is going to plague you know the industry. But really I think it's just you know one small component of the overall Cosmos ecosystem. And the rest of the Cosmos ecosystem is just firing on all fronts.

And it almost seems as though there's a new Cosmos chain popping up every week or so. And so, you know for a lot of users that want to access that ecosystem and in the value that is being built in that ecosystem, Evmos offers a gateway for that. You know, we are not a bridge, as mentioned, we are working with Nomad for bridging. And Nomad in connects make it you know really easy to bridge assets back and forth. And then Evmos being kind of a gateway, you're actually able to interact with all of these Cosmos applications and Cosmos chains. But with that friendly EVM environment, especially for Ethereum, users that are familiar with metamask, this is going to be a lot more familiar than having to switch to a new wallet and kind of a new way of interacting with applications as a result. But then also, for developers, it means that developers can now take advantage of all of the value in this ecosystem, and not have to worry about you know, relearning how to build contracts or building contracts in Cosmos. It also means that for developers, they get access to all of the tools and services that they're used to in an EVM environment.

You know, a lot of applications are reliant on Multiphysics, like Gnosis safe. They're reliant on indexers, like the Graph, and Kive and Covalent. Reliance on Oracle services like Flux network and Chainlink. And so you know, just really trying to bring these two ecosystems together. And also just going back to the overall premise of Evmos with trying to expand the functionality of the EVM. You know, we're really focused on hey, we are not trying to compete with Ethereum or these other VMs, we think that there's a place for all of us in this ecosystem. And so we want to enable this new functionality and these new use cases and new applications, for users to be able to interact with and gain value out of

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  34:42
So sounds like as a platform or as a developer, really it should be a pretty smooth transition should just be able to plug in port your whole experience and your whole workflow, just like that and get started get working and expose yourself and your community to a whole new community?

Liam | EVMOS  35:00
Exactly. And so you know, it's the transition time is you know pretty much zero, which makes it easy. And then you're still getting access to you know all of this new value accrual.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  35:16
I love that. I love it. Christian.

Christian | Saddle  35:22
Yes. Oh, yeah. So I do have a question. But I want to get your big picture thoughts. This is going to go out to 4T2 and Evmos team. So we'll start with the Evmos team. What do you anticipate the consequences of the Luna UST fiasco being in the near and medium future?

Liam | EVMOS  35:45
Yeah, I mean, you know, for one there's especially on the near term you know there was a lot of campaigns that we were working on with Terra, to bring UST incentives or other incentive programs to Evmos. So you know, having the lack of those incentives you know it's definitely unfortunate. With that said you know we've already got folks, you know, applying to our community governance pool, to replicate some of those incentives and to fill that void.

And so to see the the community taking action, and getting involved is really exciting to see, and not letting that get them down. In terms of the long term effects, I think you know for one, I wish the Terra team the best of luck in rebuilding, I know, they have plans to you know potentially fork Terra and you know rebuild their ecosystem and you know if they are able to successfully do that we absolutely want to continue working with them in the future. But I think there's going to be a you know just a lot more discussion and the need for discussion that has been around for a while of just like how do we make sure that we create enough education and support to support individuals you know I have a lot of friends both that are very crypto native, as well as crypto beginners that were affected by the Terra situation, just because they didn't fully understand the risks involved. And there's risk to everything in life, right?

And it's just really important that we make those risks known and aware for people, and so that we can have a proper conversation about it. It's very easy to look at the Terra situation and say oh this is why crypto is bad, this is why crypto is doomed. These are all of the bad things that are happening in crypto. And that's that's an easy you know finger to point. But I would prefer for us to take advantage of the situation say, hey, what can we learn from this situation? How do we make sure that we don't repeat these mistakes in the future? Because you know everybody makes mistakes, it happens. You know, we've certainly had our fair share of mistakes with Evmos. But the important part is that we learn from it and that makes all of us better.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  37:53
Excellent. That sounds like actually some advice I've been giving my mother since I convinced her to invest in crypto  and all of this happened. So Evmos, here we are now as we say we are-,

Christian | Saddle  38:13
Let's let 4T2 share their thoughts on the situation as well, before we continue.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  38:20
I guess I suppose that would be valuable

Christian | Saddle  38:30
Then yeah, so do you want to would you like to share your thoughts on how you think the fallout of the UST Luna fiasco is going to be played out in the next you know, next few weeks next few months, maybe even years going forward? How do you anticipate the fallout of this planning out?

OxAces  38:51
Yeah, I Okay. Yeah.

Dan | 4T2  38:59
Sorry, I actually had some connection issues. Can you hear me okay? Yeah

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  39:02
I also had some to say.

Dan | 4T2  39:05
Okay. Yeah, I think just to say, I think echoing what Liam said, I mean, I think on one hand that shows what what's just happened shows how the risks that are involved with the crypto industry as a whole, but if you also look at it, like. I saw a tweet recently that showed that the amount wiped out, but this was almost as big as like as Lehman Brothers was, you know, so this was a huge huge scale event and yet, we still see a resilient community that's still fighting back.

You hear developers on Terra still going for it still trying to rebuild and I guess, reignite like the positive environment or the positive building environment that they had. And so the way that I look at this is this is definitely a speed bump, like for the crypto industry without a doubt. But, I mean, how many years was UST going for? Like and versus how many years do we foresee the crypto DeFi industry continuing? Like 4T2 and our team looks at this, like, it's a tenure play kind of thing. So although the speed bump definitely set us back, and there's definitely a lot of learning to be had from it and we do think that these these types of collapses are probably necessary to find a more sustainable industry going forward. So yes, the Cosmos ecosystem was heavily impacted by this. But no, we don't think that that the long term effects, even the medium term effects will be too negative. So that's the approach we're taking.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  40:52
I totally agree with that as well. We are at just the very beginning of the ecosystem as a whole. And the Ethos is only just being developed, right? And ingrained into our minds here. So I would actually like to open up the stage to some questions from the audience. If possible, I feel as though it's a good time for that. If we have any. Please raise your hand and maybe we can bring you up here. Is everybody okay with that? Do we trust this audience?

Christian | Saddle  41:25
Yeah, I would love to hear some questions from the audience.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  41:41
Okay, let's do it. If you have any, please raise your hand. We'll pull you up here. I believe I saw Gus raise his hand. Is that true Gus? Can you send me another emoji if that's true? Not at the moment. Excellent. Well, we'd like to get any last or final closing words in Evmos.

Liam | EVMOS  42:11
You know, nothing huge for me. Really just excited about 4T2 as well as Saddle in the ecosystem. I know Saddle is already live on Evmos, which is super exciting. And incentive programs are going to be kicking off in the next couple of weeks to get all of you users nice tasty APYs on your stables. Certainly looking to that and looking forward to the continued collaboration with you both.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  42:41
Yes, we're absolutely looking forward to it as well, as I'm sure Christian can attest to as our local Evmos bull.

Christian | Saddle  42:54
4T2 do you have any final thoughts you want to share?

Dan | 4T2  42:57
Yeah, just thanks to Evmos and then the Evmos team for really like pushing through on getting their vision rolled up and we're in this for the long term. So we look forward to what the future holds there. And then to the Saddle team. Yeah, I look forward to working with you guys. You guys are a great team. I mean from the discussions that we've had, and looking forward to seeing how we can partner together to as you mentioned, how we can grow this ecosystem and look at essentially helping Evmos to also connect with other chains and bringing interoperability through the Cosmos ecosystem.

Christian | Saddle  43:37
Yeah, definitely want to echo the sense that we're all very excited work together. I do want to make sure that the community knows so Saddle will be launching four pool with USDC, USDT, Frax and DAI, sometime today, if not tomorrow, and that will go up on the on the Saddle front end on the Evmos blockchain. And then incentives will follow shortly after we anticipate early next week but the liquidity pools will be live hopefully today or tomorrow.

Other than that, please we encourage everyone to reach out to both the Evmos team, the 4T2 team, Saddle as well. Follow us on Twitter, hop on our Discord. As a reminder we also have bounties that anybody can take up and earn some Saddle themselves we want to prioritize making this a group effort a community led effort we eventually want to end this up as a DAO, as controlled by the community and this is a first step to getting us in that direction. And so if you have any skills technical or non technical, please feel free to go to our website, look for bounties for bandits, tackle some bounties yourself and get involved the community and walk away with a little smile on your pocket as well.

Low Poly Duck | Saddle  44:59
Yes, I'd also like to paste on to the end of that just to announce quickly that we have deployed fixed versions of our metapools, and you should be able to migrate pretty soon. I'd also like to double down on thanking Evmos and 4T2 for being here with us, as well as 0xAces. And actually everybody who has been behind the Evmos twitter there. Thank you guys so much and we look forward to our future together.

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